Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 6: Foster care, legal sign off, thanks

Here is the last segment of Dr Phil. It’s the legal disclaimer section. Dr Phil makes sure to document her passed Nadya off and he’s done. Linda Pate Wallace is on again (she was on the previous show as well)

(4-21) Updated list of octuplet posts
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 1: Nadya; *Angels in Waiting* firing
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 2: Jeff Czech: “Hogging the media”
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 3: No more Nadya for him
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 4: Tuberculosis, nannies
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 5: Allred vs Czech
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 6: Foster care, legal sign off, thanks
============================================
March 26, 2009

Dr Phil’s website (pix, too)

Dr Phil starts out with his legal disclaimer.

When I got involved in this story, it was because Robin and I have spent a long, long time with The Dr. Phil Foundation and other efforts to work with foster and disadvantaged children, and those children who are at high-risk, and these were certainly children at high risk. I said, ‘I’m going to step into this and see if I can figure out what’s going on and get some kind of way for these kids to have a chance, to have a chance at some kind of reasonable treatment.’

Of course, everybody in America was yelling, ‘Take those children away and put them in foster care.’

The truth is that A) that’s not a good option and B) you just can’t do that.

Public policy in America is that the biological parents really have powerful rights and big responsibilities with regard to kids. You just can’t step in and say, ‘Well, I don’t like this woman’s decisions. I think we should take those children and give them away.’ Fortunately, it’s not that easy. You can’t do that.

Then Dr Phil introduces attorney and child advocate LINDA WALLACE PATE. She was on the previous show as well, chronicling the horrors of foster care. This time she talks about the procedures involved in removing a child from her/his parents. Note the criteria includes: “immediate threat to the children’s health and safety”, which is why Angels in Waiting made their reports. There’s no doubt in anyone’s mind that the night she brought home the first two octuplets was extremely dangerous and showed a monumental lack of maternal judgment. Even Kaiser threatened not to send any more of the preemies home.

Then there were the intruders in the yard and at the door and ther resistance to hiring security. Nadya didn’t do anything about security until after the car seat that was on her porch was thrown through the back window of her vehicle. They could have just as easily broken into the house and, yes, abducted the babies. And then the health risk of Tuberculosis.

All three were reports were not only justified, by law, AIW had to act.

LINDA WALLACE PATE:

In order to remove children from their parents, the children have to be in immediate danger of physical abuse or sexual abuse, or the environment is an immediate threat to the children’s health and safety. That’s to remove the child without a court order. You’re essentially arresting a child. Social workers have the police power to come into your home, if the child is in immediate danger.

In this case, although Tuesday night when the first babies came home, I don’t think we got to that point of immediate danger, but I do believe that it was very toxic to the children. I believe that when you over-stimulate premature babies like that, that that can have a long-term effect on their development. They have a problem with sensory integration as adults. These are very serious issues.

The preemies went from the womb to the neonatal ICU to that mob scene. An adult who had just emerged from a coma wouldn’t have tolerated it.

DR PHIL:

I did speak to L.A. County Department of Child and Family and Services. I did talk to Kaiser Permanente, and I talked with Dr. Reilly from Orange County. He’s the chief deputy director of social services there.

Basically, what I said to all of these people is, ‘My involvement was to get into this story to help facilitate the best situation for these children. We’re now in the second chapter of that, and it seems to be running more smoothly, so we are going to step out of this story,’ because I don’t want to be a part of any [media] frenzy.’

He washed his hands of all liability by talking to these folks directly. He made known his concerns - made sure they documented them and then told them he was done. Bye bye Nadya. Then he goes back into the transparency issue to make his concerns known to the audience and general public.

Dr Phil relates the conversation he had with DR REILLY regarding Nadya and her new babies.

DR PHIL:

[Reilly] said, ‘Our approach is that we have all of these wonderful community centers throughout Orange County, lots of them, that offer everything from parent training to stress-relaxation sort of things, fun things for the family to do on a budget, all of these different things they can do to help the parents rise up to the occasion and not take the kids away.’

[To Pate] That is only as a last resort that they [remove children from the home]. It’s very difficult to do, and that is not the prime directive of Child Protective Services or social services, correct?

LINDA WALLACE PATE:

That’s correct. The paradigm shift for the last 10 or 15 years has been to keep the family intact. The outcomes are so poor in foster care. Children are, as we talked about before, four times more likely to be abused and neglected in foster care than with their biological parents or their relatives. Every effort must be made. We need to circle the wagons, we need to take all the resources that we have, we need to let all the drama subside. We need to get very Zen in this environment and give this family some privacy.

I’m all for transparency, but families have to have privacy too.

DR PHIL:

Private transparency, but nonetheless, a transparency to the agency. That’s all I’m saying in this situation. Having a mandated reporter inside the house helps a lot, because they are taken much more seriously, because they are informed reporters.

DR PHIL to Czech - more legal disclaimer to make sure she is not at risk t her self or others.

I don’t think there’s a mean bone in Nadya’s body. When I say that the children are at risk, I don’t think she would do anything ugly with children. What I mean is just getting overwhelmed and things falling through the cracks if there isn’t enough support. That’s your concern, right? Just making sure she has enough support.

JEFF CZECH: Absolutely.

GLORIA ALLRED:

Dr. Phil, let’s face it: Kaiser Permanente is not going to be in that home 24/7. That’s what we’re concerned about. What we’re concerned about is the record of Nadya in the next week, which should be a good indicator for what may happen in the future.

I want to make sure that everybody understands that Angels in Waiting wanted nothing more than for Nadya to succeed. They made every effort to help her, to support her, to train her, to educate her.

If she felt like a stranger, it’s because she didn’t come in to be with her babies except very little, a lot of the time only when the media was filming, and these babies need bonding, they need to be held by their mommy. They need to be fed by their mommy. They need to be changed and bathed by their mommy. They need to be loved and hear the sound of their mommy’s voice. That is how we create bonding, that is how we create trust in babies, and on that score, Dr. Phil, she failed miserably, and the record supports that.

We hope the future will be different for the sake of these babies.

DR PHIL:

I think she says, clearly, she was made to feel uncomfortable, she was made to feel like she was doing something wrong, that she wasn’t being helped, that she was being criticized and judged. That is no way to feel in your own home with your own babies.

LINDA WEST-CONFORTI:

We reached out to help this woman. We tried to show her the proper bonding. Dr. Phil, she wasn’t at home.

We would ask, ‘Where’s Nadya?’ Nobody knew where she was. She would come home at midnight with Gap bags in her hands. She wasn’t available to us for teaching. She wasn’t available to us to tell, ‘Nadya, come on, let’s do a feeding on one of your babies,’ or ‘It’s bath time.’”

Now this next question is plain crazy. Why does a woman with 14 children - only eight of whom are new need to be told what to do? To be told not to go shopping? To be told her baby needs a bath or a feeding? And how are they going to “sit down with her if she isn’t there and doesn’t trust them?

DR PHIL:

Did you sit down with her and say, ‘You seem to be absent. We need more time’?

LINDA WEST-CONFORTI:

Yes. I sat down with her. Annie Young sat down with her. We sat and we had a conference. She was supposed to give [her octuplet son] Elijah a bath, and it took four days. We ended up giving the child a bath.

If true, that is obscene. Nadya’s first publicist, Joann Killeen, said that her duties ended up including bathing and babysitting the old children.[3-27]

DR PHIL to Allred:

You’re concerned she’s going to be under-involved going forward?

GLORIA ALLRED:

My concern is, she wasn’t involved the first week. Where is she going to be the second, third, fourth and fifth? Everyone in this room is concerned about these children, but we are not there yet. You don’t have to be the best parent to keep your children. You just have to be good enough.

You just have to be in the room.

LINDA WALLACE PATE:

She has to be good enough. She’s got to get better, because she is going to be at risk of losing these children. This cannot continue, because these children will become failure to thrive. They have to be bonded with their mother. It’s important that she understands that this is the end of the road for her.

The government and Child Protective Services are not going to wait until these children slump into a failure to thrive. We need to make sure that they’re on the right track now.

Nadya’s lawyer wakes up and decides to earn his money. Look at his picture - he barely survived.

JEFF CZECH:

This is just reinforcing what I’ve seen in Nadya’s decision. The best step she could have made is to move on. This is a situation that was going nowhere. Clearly, constant judgment is not going to help the situation. Nadya does not have to be under a microscope 24 hours a day. That’s not going to help her. I guarantee you, she’s spending a lot more time now with those babies.

He just admitted she wasn’t spending much to begin with. Nadya admits she’s dealing with it by denial.

GLORIA ALLRED:

She doesn’t want the privacy. She wants only one side to come out, Dr. Phil, because every day she’s blogging to the public about what she’s doing.

JEFF CZECH shows once again he’s a minnow in a shark’s den:

Trust me, she doesn’t want you in her kitchen anymore.

GLORIA ALLRED:

You will only now hear one side of the story: the spin placed on Nadya, the spin placed by Jeff. That’s all fine and good, but we care about protecting the babies.

Dr Phil now gets on record AIW’s and Allred’s statements that they are officially finished too.

DR PHIL ask AIW:

At this point, you guys are out?

LINDA WEST-CONFORTI: Correct.

DR PHIL:

At this point, I’m saying I’m going to take a respectful step back and allow this to go forward.

DR PHIL to Allred;

Is that your plan, at this point? Do you step back and let Kaiser do their job?

GLORIA ALLRED:

We really have no choice. We couldn’t let this situation continue, so yes, we will be stepping back. We will be praying and hoping for the best for these little babies, and for their six siblings, and for Nadya, but we’re not really optimistic about their future.

DR PHIL Back to AIW (and Kaiser)

I want to say, and go on record saying, that I have sat with Linda, I have sat with Jackie. I have talked about your childcare philosophies, your intervention strategies, the systems you put in place, the things that you do, and I could not be more impressed with what y’all do. The dynamic here didn’t work.

Y’all clearly are cutting edge professionals and know what you’re doing. I say the same thing about Kaiser Permanente, having been over there, and met with those folks, and visited with them, and been in the NICU [Neonatal Intensive Care Unit], and talked to the nurses there and gotten a feeling and a vibe for everything. Those are dedicated, caring professionals.

And then the poor folks who went out of their way to donate time, material and labor to get the house set up and there’s not oing to be any more mentions of them. That isn’t fair. They got flat out ripped off and the next needy family won’t get it because of Nadya.

They don’t look too happy, do they?

Left - Shalena Smith, Ga Ga Designs provided the nursery, which Nadya didn’t make a point of thanking on air during her radaronline videos. All it would have taken was a few shots of the nursery to thank Smith.

Right - Amy Phillips, Uptown Flooring and Design provided the carpets and flooring in Nadya’s house.

Dr Phil was pist too because he was the one who arranged it. Hopefully he’ll make good with them. He covers their disclaimer.

DR PHIL:

I know you did it for the babies more than the mom. That doesn’t mean you support her decisions to have gone and gotten pregnant again. But you had the ability to look past the situation and keep your eye only on the babies. That’s so compassionate, and I really thank you guys for doing that.

He thanks Stan Whitaker, Whitaker General Contracting, who oversaw the general contracting of her home.

Young America, who donated furniture for Nadya’s older children.

Million Dollar Baby outfitted the nursery.

Higher America donated a brand-new convertible bottom drawer refrigerator for the octuplets.

Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 5 Allred vs Czech

Updated list of octuplet posts (4-22)

Trying to empty out some of the drafts.

This is Part 5 (second day) of Dr Phil Show discussing the firing of Angels in Waiting. On set are the lawyers: Allred & Jeff Czech; AIW: Linda West-Conforti & Jackie Peebles and Dr Phil. It’s rather embarrassing to see/hear them go at it like sniping middle schoolers. Czech was like a lamb to the slaughter and he knew it. Dr Phil gave Allred a lot of latitude but had to rescue Czech. Dr Phil knew enough to avoid “shrill” - he uses “strident”.

(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 1: Nadya; *Angels in Waiting* firing
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 2: Jeff Czech: “Hogging the media”
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 3: No more Nadya for him
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 4: Tuberculosis, nannies
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 5: Allred vs Czech
============================================

March 26, 2009

From Dr Phil’s wesite [emphasis added]

GLORIA ALLRED:

One of the reasons that we care about transparency is so that not only can we tell Child Protective Services, which must be done for the protection of these little, innocent, precious babies, but in addition, so the public knows. The fact is that bringing in Kaiser means that, yes, some of them are mandated reporters, and we hope that they will report to Child Protective Services, but the public now is shutdown, is shutout.

That is what Jeff and Nadya want, for the public only to hear their side, which is going to be, ‘Aw, how wonderful everything is,’ and not to know the truth about what’s really going on inside the house, whether or not these babies are in danger, and that is wrong.

The whole point of Angels in Waiting USA, besides providing such high-quality care from these wonderful pediatric nurses and educational consultants, was not to put the burden on the taxpayer, but this is what Nadya and Jeff are doing; shut everybody up, put the burden on the taxpayer. That’s wrong, and I want to know what they’re hiding and why.

JEFF CZECH:

It is certainly not my intention, I know it’s not Nadya’s intention, to hide from the public. Nadya wants her own life. I think any mother who has 50 kids doesn’t necessarily want to be public with the private issues in her life.

That comment is so ludicrous it isn’t even funny. Nadya sits everyday and chats to radaronline about her life. Nobody’s forcing her and she knows the videos go online uncensored. He knew he shouldnt have said it and Allred pounced.

ALLRED:

She’s public every day, Jeff. That’s why the paparazzi were there the first night. She went on the media and announced that the babies were coming home.

CZECH:

It was pretty calm until you showed up with your briefcase in hand, held a press conference and then refused to leave the premises.

First he complains about her “hogging the media” and then wants to know where Nadya’s money is.

CZECH:

I have repeatedly asked Gloria for an accounting. Nadya needs to plan. I didn’t get that transparency.

He’s all about transparency when it comes to cash.

ALLRED holds up a stack of printed out emails.

You got numerous e-mails, Jeff. Saying, ‘Jeff, can we have a meeting with the nurses, and Nadya, and Dr. Phil, and you and me?’

CZECH:

I’m very busy. It’s hard to have a meeting every five minutes.

He’s reacting like a child who doesn’t know what excuse to use and she’s got him in her sights.

ALLRED:

We asked for one meeting. We had to discuss the catastrophe that occurred Tuesday night, because you and Nadya failed to plan and provide adequate security, and because you dared to tell the media when the babies were coming home. If it had been done quietly, these babies would not have been placed at risk.

And as to the accounting, as Dr. Phil knows from all of these e-mails, we said we’d be very happy to tell you about the funds. Let’s have a meeting, either in person or have a conference call on the phone. You refused to do either for almost a week.

DR PHIL realizes it’s his show and addresses Allred:.

Are you being too strident [aka shrill] in this situation? It seems like there’s constant criticism, and I wonder if she did feel threatened by this Angels in Waiting USA contingent? And she felt like, ‘I’m being constantly judged, and they’re not helping me if they see a problem; they’re reporting me. They’re not assisting, and it seems to be adversarial.’

What gave it away Dr Phil? He asks Czech if Nadya’s on welfare and he pretends he doesn’t know. Where’s that transparency?

DR PHIL:

You say that this may fall back to Medi-Cal, or [Nadya] is on Medi-Cal right now, true?

CZECH:

If Medi-Cal took care of the initial birth, etc., then what’s going on now is probably a continuation of that. I’ve not verified that with Nadya. But let me stress, Nadya doesn’t want this anymore. She wants to be on her own.

Yeah and she just wanted one more child when she couldn’t support the 6 she already had. And her oldest daughter didn’t want the octuplets to come home. Words mean nothing.

DR PHIL:

Here’s what gets people upset. I am told that while all of this is going on, and she’s trying to situate the kids, and get the nursery right, and get people flowing and all of that sort of thing, she’s taking money and installing a big hot tub in the master suite at this house. When people hear that — if it’s true, and I don’t know if it’s true. If it’s not, tell me it’s not — people wonder why would we be A) making donations, and B) letting this fall on taxpayers, when here’s somebody who’s doing that kind of thing of thing.

Is that true or false?

CZECH explains that the plumbing is bad, and the bathtub leaks into the kitchen.

She had to replace the tub. Nadya’s using her own sources. She has made some money. She has to. She’s in a situation where she’s never going to be looked at very favorably.

And she’s doing nothing to improve matters. And the story of the tub continues to evolve. First her friends gave it to her, then it was donated, then she bought it herself. In one of her RadarOnline videos she takes the cameraman into the bathron

JACKIE PEEBLES (AIW):

When Gloria came, and I was asked by one of the people from the media, ‘Why is Gloria here? Please ask her to leave,’ I said, ‘I don’t understand the confusion. I really don’t’. Gloria came, said, ‘I don’t want a press conference. I don’t want my face on the media.’ She sat down at the kitchen table … This was a happy day for the union, for all of us coming together and bringing the babies home. It was quiet. Gloria was sitting there at the kitchen table, no conference, nothing going on.

DR PHIL to Czech:

Did you want Gloria out of there that night, and did you get in her face and attack her, yelling and pointing your finger in her face to get her out?

CZECH:

Nadya and I were locked up with the Kaiser people for, I don’t how long, four or five hours, and during this time, apparently the ruckus was building at Nadya’s home, and we did not even know. Information was filtering in to me that there were a lot of unnecessary people at that house, and so I started asking my staffers to politely ask all unnecessary people, and Gloria Allred was one of them — she didn’t have to be there — I asked everybody to leave, and they did.

[He says he spoke with Gloria, and she went into the backyard.]

It was complete mayhem.

And who caused it to be that way? Who told the paparazzi exactly when she would be bringing them home? Who didn’t have any type of security in place?

ALLRED, chomping to cross examine him and trap him in lies:

This is just so much nonsense. What happened was, yes, Jeff asked the press, and there were numerous representatives of the media — cameras, audio equipment, video equipment, wires, cords, lights — by the way, a lot of which was set up in this very small nursery later in the night when these little preemies came home, exposing these little babies to high risk of infection and danger — but in any event, yes, he asked them to clear out.

But guess what? Before Nadya came home with the babies, he let everybody back in.

[She explains that she was at the house to protect the nurses.]

They were going into a high-risk situation, because Nadya had announced all these media people were there. I wanted to make sure that they could do their job and not be bullied, and not be prevented from caring for these little babies.

She pushed him enough to make him speak the truth even though he wasn’t aware of it. He basically admits he was pist she got the media questions and interviews that night not him.

CZECH:

Gloria, I think you can care about the nurses and about the babies in the confines of your own home. You were part of the ruckus, because you’re a well-known attorney, and a lot of people want to see you, so that was part of it. That was the reason I asked you to leave, along with everyone else. I did not ask them to come back in.

He just admitted that he did not have control of the situation. And Allred says he lost control of himself as well.

ALLRED:

Well, they did come back in, so somebody gave them permission. Maybe it was your wife.

When you arrived with Nadya, you didn’t ask them to leave. Instead, what you did in the presence of the nurses and everyone else there, you came in like Raging Bull 2. You came in, you went within one inch of one of our nannies’ noses … and you stood there, and you put your finger like this, and you jabbed your finger at her, and you were yelling at this poor little nanny, ‘Who are you? Get the [expletive] out of here!’

She says that Jeff then came up to her, pointed a finger in her face and yelled.

The worst was you yelled, and you punched your fist right to the wall of nursery. Those little babies were inside. How scary for these little babies.

She’s good at always coming back to the babies. He and Nadya talk about them as commoditites. He of course denies doing any of the sort.

LINDA WEST-CONFORTI:

You did too, Jeff. That’s when I said, ‘I will take you out.’

Reads like the Godfather doesn’t it?

Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 4: Tuberculosis, nannies

Updated list of octuplet posts (4-22)

Getting around to some of the drafts. This is the second day of Dr Phil Show discussing the firing of Angels in Waiting. At the end of the show Dr Phil officially said he washed his hands of Nadya. So far he’s kept to his word…at least publicly.

FYI: One of the 3 reports filed by AIW to Child Protective Services was about possible exposure to tuberculosis (TB). The nannies-to-be were given routine skin tests (ppd) to check for TB. They had positive reactions. The question then is: do they have active disease or just prior exposure? A chest x-ray helps determine that, which they had not yet had. So they potentially could have been in there taking care of the preemies with active TB. At least one of them was coughing.

They evidently never came back after the initial training - while AIW was still there. I don’t know if Kaiser nurses have tested the octuplets or the other children for TB exposure.

(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 1: Nadya; *Angels in Waiting* firing
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 2: Jeff Czech: “Hogging the media”
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 3: No more Nadya for him
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 4: Tuberculosis, nannies
(3-26) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 5: Allred vs Czech
===========================================

March 26, 2009

From the Dr Phil website.

DR PHIL to Nadya’s attorney, Jeff Czech: Are you comfortable that these children are safe?

JEFF CZECH:

Honest to goodness, I am. Nadya really does care for these children. She does spend some time. There have been some days in the very recent past where Nadya was spread out very, very thin. It was not her intent that that would occur, but she was thrown into a situation whereby she was surrounded by media beyond her wildest imaginations, and it was obviously the first time that she ever encompassed a situation like that.

She knew what she was getting into when she had those embryos implanted. Kaiser is training Nadya and the nannies and making sure the house is safe all courtesy of California taxpayers.

CZECH: [Kaiser] They call me all the time and ask me what the situation is. They ask me for reports, what am I doing for safety, what am I doing for security, so I’m following up with them as well. They’re very concerned.

DR PHIL: Who is paying for all of this now?

JEFF CZECH:

Kaiser Permanente has informed me that this is basically typical. Because there are so many babies, they are extending it a little bit.

He notes that the hospital and nurses are paid by Medi-Cal, while Nadya pays the nannies’ salaries from money she’s earned.

The nurses aren’t going to be there forever. They’re there to train, they’re there to help, they’re there to implement, and once they’re happy with the way things are going, they’re out of the picture.

Kaiser is billing Medi-Cal for everything including the Social Workers’ visits, the nurses, the training of the nannies, all the octuplet’s care. Nadya is responsible for paying the nannies and has a “goal” to get her kids of Medi-Cal. Delusion.

CZECH: She wants off, and quite frankly, she was a little uncomfortable with Angels in Waiting for that reason, too, because she was aware that they were being funded by donations.

So who is going to pay for the children’s healthcare for the next 18 years if it isn’t the state or donations?

DR PHIL to Linda West-Conforti, co-founder of Angels in Waiting USA.

Do you have concerns about these nannies who are there? If there are sick nannies in the house, if there are people who [test] positive for tuberculosis, that’s troubling to me.

WEST-CONFORTI:

I’m not saying they’re positive for tuberculosis. They’re testing that they’ve had it before. I’m not sure that they’re symptomatic at the time that they’re coming in, but the big question is we don’t know. They have not been ruled out that they are not active carriers.

DR PHIL: Were there nannies in the home who tested positive?

WEST-CONFORTI:

Yes, there were three of them who tested positive. Nadya gave her permission without talking to us nurses or Kaiser, that it was OK for them to come in as long as they wore a mask until they got their X-ray back and read by a physician.

DR PHIL: Is that OK?

WEST-CONFORTI:

No. Nadya was so under the gun to have enough nannies to show the hospital that they’re able to send the next babies home, that she jeopardized the welfare of these infants.

JACKIE PEEBLES, co-founder of Angels in Waiting USA

They didn’t wear a mask. People need to know that. Nobody wore a mask. During the training, the ladies are still in the home. Nobody put a mask on.

The point she is making is that Nadya knowingly exposed her preemies to the possibility of TB. Nadya pays for the nannies herself and women fresh to the country are obviously cheaper. Financial decision. But a simple mask would have shown some maternal judgment.

What was left unsaid — the Kaiser nurses knew the women had positive skin tests and they did not demand the women wear masks.

(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 1: Nadya; *Angels in Waiting* firing
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil Part 2: Jeff Czech: “Hogging the media”
(3-25) Octuplets: Dr Phil, Part 3: No more Nadya for him

Octuplets: Nadya's lawyer, Jeff Czech Q & A (Part 1)

April 11, 2009

(4-8) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

Nadya's lawyer, Jeff Czech's turn to tell his side of the situation. Raul Roa aka Octorazzi did a Q & A of sorts. They discuss AIW, Allred, the agreements between AIW & Nadya and the appearance on the Dr Phil show where Czech actually said that Allred was "hogging the media". [follow update link 3-26 Dr Phil Part 2]

The typos are as is in the quotes.

About the non-disclosure form he wanted AIW and Gloria Allred to sign:

CZECH: I require all persons entering the Suleman home on business to execute a simple non-disclosure agreement. AIW nurses were not excepted, especially when I learned they were photographing the house and persons inside and then lied/denied it. In fact, that is what Allred and I basically argued about the night the first two babies arrived.

And the transparency agreement between AIW and Nadya?

CZECH: The "agreement" that Allred prepared was just a document she put together for the show so she could have a photo session over it and have something to exhibit on the show. It was not a legally binding contract that could be "breached". Nadya did not read it; I took no part in it; I was not even shown the document until after the show, but I knew it was not a "real" contract.

He didn't know about it is supposed to be an excuse? And he never saw it but knew it wasn't a real contract. See the copy of the contract below. It appears that AIW and Nadya both signed it. There is no third party signature or handwritten date, but if both signatures are legitimate - so is the agreement. As saying she did not read something that consists of two sentences and signed it anyway just adds to the argument that she has no judgment.

His tone alone says alot.

Sounds there was some truth to AIW taking pictures. Doesn't say exactly what they took the pictures of. It was meant that they not take photos to sell or otherwise promote. Photographing evidence of neglect or too back up their reports to CPS is another story.

CZECH: The nurses were offering free services and that was the main attraction. Dr. Phil pushed AIW on Nadya also. In the green room, however, Allred had Linda Conforti sign an agreement that the nurses would not take photos, thus you see why I took Allred to task after the nurses were caught taking photos. AIW also promised to provide an accounting of donations and to provide their credentials and proof of insurance to me; they provided nothing after several requests.

AIW alleges that out of the 102 hours they were present (March 17-22), Nadya was in the nursery caring for her preemies for only a total of 8. [ 3-27 Allred/Conforti-West on Early Show] The AIW nurses kept charts and there's all the radaronline footage of her shopping and outside the home.

CZECH: I don't know how Conforti came up with 105 hours; she certainly was not personally there that much and slept all night if she was there at night time.

Here he says the babies just needed to be cared for like "normal babies". They are not normal babies, even more so because of the environment they live in.

CZECH: According to Kaiser, the babies would not be released until they could be cared for like 'normal' babies. So no, they did not require special care other than to take extra precautions to keep sickness away. The training that Kaiser provided the nannies involved feeding, cleaning, cpr, caring/holding the infants. Nothing like Conforti was claiming was necessary.

Here again it's self interest vs professional experience. Kaiser is losing money for as long as the octuplets are in the hospital. Potential private insurance patients are kept from getting a bed, which is being billed to Medi-Cal. Getting them out of the hospital and into home care is a win-win. They open the beds for paying patients and still bill the state for their home health care nurses. AIW was going to included intensive treatment for all 14 - something Kaiser cannot.

His logic is a tad convoluted here.

CZECH: Regarding Kaiser and Medi-Cal, I believe that Kaiser is still billing Medi-Cal for the final treatment of the babies. Keep in mind that this is not unusual. Ms. Allred's... statement that Suleman has chosen to put the burden on the taxpayers is flat out wrong.

First, Kaiser would be involved whether or not AIW was involved.

Second, Conforti stated that if enough money was not raised then she would bill medical for AIW's services.

So you see, Nadya's decision to dump AIW is actually beneficial to the taxpayers and those persons willing to donate to AIW. Nadya pays for the nannies herself and soon Kaiser will end its major treatments.

Kaiser, Medi-Cal, nurses, taxpayers...And where was any words about what was best for the octuplets, and more importantly, the older children who are being neglected in all of this? As far as I am aware, the older children have not received any type of counseling to help them adapt to the octuplets. The oldest girl said on video that she didn't want the octuplets to come home because the crying would set off Nadya.

Who is looking out for her needs? And why doesn't/shouldn't the little girl's opinion matter?

Source: Octorazzi

Octuplets: Nadya: *Angels in Waiting* was a scam

April 8, 2009

(4-8) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

What is there left to say about this woman? She is sticking to the story that Angels in Waiting (AIW) wanted to abduct her babies. Has she given it a moment of thought? Where were they going to abduct them to?

According to Octorazzi, In Touch Weekly did a cover story and allegedly did not speak directly to her - using spliced interview clips and photos from an agency. Nadya says she is going to sue them for “defamation of character”. No I’m not going to touch that.

The title of the April 13th magazine: “Loving Mother Or… Mom From Hell?

I don’t know exactly what was written but they said that a source told them she is talking about a 24/7 reality show when all the kids get home. [Josiah home link] but she says it’s 100% lies.

She then spoke with on camera with RAUL ROA about AIW. Each time the story grows. Rough translation added to ROA’s. Video provided from his as well - it is his voice on the video.

NADYA: The Angels in Waiting that was like the biggest joke. It was a scam from the beginning. They’re licensed foster moms and they had the foster moms all lined up - for each baby - where they’d go. And they would actually set up the home with dirty bottles and diapers on the ground, and take pictures of that. pretending like that it was real before I even got to the house. And whenever someone said take the camera - they’d hide the camera and it was like 5-6 times. They were lying–they were documenting lies.

Eight hours in the nursery, are they kidding me?

I think it was 8 hours out of 102 hours they documented - follow link above to Allred press conference.

NADYA: The worst part about them is that they were threatening to abduct the babies. And they wanted me in Lake Arrowhead. They said you can go off, you can go back to school and do what you want - we’ll take the babies. So they could abduct the babies. So they could take the babies. They had foster parents already lined up and then they would have claimed that I abandoned the babies. And then they would have taken them.

I know that.

Paranoia. And she rattles off that the Kaiser, doctors, nannies and social social workers can vouch for everything. Of course they had foster moms set up - that’s their job. Then she talks about AIW billing Medi-Cal and that’s why she didn’t want anything to do with them. Listen to her tone of voice. How much is her octuplet’s hospital bill? Has to be well over a million dollars that she is not paying.

NADYA: They said to me - they said to everyone that if they don’t get enough donations, they’re going to bill Medi-Cal. They already get money through Medi-Cal by the way.

And so does she three of her older children are on disability of some sort and yet not receiving any specialized care. And she has yet to justify the fact that all 14 of her children would have gotten specialized care. Who is looking out for the autistic boy? Listen to her indignation. The truth is she figured out that no money would go directly to her.

NADYA: And they are lying to everyone by saying that this is free. Yeah. Free if the public pays for it. Free if they bill Medi-Cal. Sure then it’s free, so then I refused to be any part of it. They were just horrible, they weren’t even polite to my children. So why should I have that, beyond negative energy? Evil. Evil. Or devils incarnate in my home.

Octuplets: Gloria Allred interview by radaronline

April 5, 2009

(4-5) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

Radaronline interview with Gloria Allred, lawyer for Angels in Waiting. Not strictly about her experience with Nadya Suleman. Allred and AIW stressed over and over the importance of security and Nadya didn't listen. Her car was then vandalized - the back window was smashed with a car seat that was on her front porch. They could have just as easily broken in or done anything else as no one stopped them or actually saw them. The report AIW made was well-founded and still Nadya did nothing. Allegedly she hired security after the car was vadalized. Octuplet #7 Josiah was brought home later the same day.

RadarOnline.com: Octo-Mom - what do you think is the best-case scenario for her?

Gloria Allred: There is none unless she decides to take an active and meaningful role in parenting all of her children

RO: Do you think she'll have her kids taken away?

GA: Only if they are neglected or abused. At this point I do think they would be better off in foster care where they can receive individualized attention and care.

RO: Do you think she's competent to raise these kids?

GA: If she continues to behave the way that she did when Angels in Waiting USA.org was in her home, I am not optimistic about her children's future. For the sake of her 14 children I hope that she gets the help that she clearly needs and readjusts her priorities. She needs to demonstrate through actions not just words that her children are more
important to her than shopping and money making schemes. Her children need their mother not more toys and photo-ops.

==== That's the end of her comments on Nadya. ====

RO: What is the No. 1 issue you are concerned with right now?

GA: Our current case before the California Supreme Court challenging Prop 8, a constitutional amendment which would deny gay and lesbian couples the right to marry in California.

RO: What case are you most proud of?

GA: All of them. Currently our victory last year before the California Supreme Court in which we won the right to marry for gay and lesbian couples.

RO: Who are the people you admire the most?

GA: Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, Susan B. Anthony, Senator Barbara Mikulski, Sojourner Truth and Benazir Bhutto.

RO: In general, do you think celebrities get a break from the justice system or are treated unfairly?

GA: There is definitely a double standard. Celebrities definitely have an advantage in the legal system.

RO: We're going to name a celebrity and you write the first thing you think of. O.J. Simpson...

GA: Double killer. One day his children will know the truth about their father.

RO: Robert Blake

GA: One lucky guy, one unlucky wife.

RO: Michael Jackson

GA: I would advise parents not to leave their children alone with him.

RO: Who has had the biggest impact on your life?

GA: My parents, my cousin Dr. Rachel Ash, my law partners Nathan Goldberg and Michael Maroko.

RO: What's the biggest regret of your career?

GA: None.

RO: Would you ever consider running for public office?

GA: No.

RO: If you could have dinner with one person who would it be and why?

GA: President Obama. I would like to discuss specifics re how the system needs to be changed so that women and minorities can truly be afforded equal protection under the law and to suggest names for him to consider for his future Supreme Court appointments, when vacancies exist on the court. I would also ask him to vigorously advocate the passage of the Equal Rights Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

Postscript: Allred will receive the Distinguished Alumni Award from the Steinhardt College of New York University on May 11. The award will be presented at the university's commencement at Radio City Music Hall. She will be giving the commencement address.

Octuplets: Gloria Allred statement (3-25)

March 30, 2009

(3-30) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

March 25th statement by Gloria Allred on behalf of Angels in Waiting (AIW)

[Emphasis added]

On March 9, 2009, Nadya Suleman and “Angels in Waiting USA.org” agreed to work together and both signed a “Declaration of Principles”, which were developed for the protection of her babies and other children.

We believe that Nadya has violated a number of those principles and that she has also attempted to renege on the principle of transparency to which she had also agreed.(Documentation attached)

[I didn't see any in the download. Follow update link to see the principles.]

Principle I stated that the best interests of Nadya’s children should, at all times, be the paramount consideration with respect to all decisions made concerning their health, safety and welfare. This principle was violated in many ways, and we will elaborate on quite a few.

First, Nadya announced to the public, including the media, when the first babies were coming home. This resulted in a forseeable frenzy of hundreds of media and onlookers coming to her home for the expected arrival. In addition to the danger presented to the babies by the chaotic situation outside of the home, she and her attorney permitted a dangerous and unhealthy environment inside of the home for the babies arrival.

Inside, media was permitted to set up dirty camera and light equipment, electrical cords, and audio equipment inside the very small nursery which held the cribs and rocking chair. The nursery had been sanitized by the nurse for the benefit of the high risk premature babies, but the presence of the media and many of their reporters, producers, camera men, audio personnel and others changed all of that immediately for the worse. It substantially increased the possibility of infection for these precious little babies and the loud noises, and shouting and decision to have talent also hold and feed the babies increased the risk of harm to them emotionally and physically.

At one point, Linda West-Conforti, tried to rescue one of the babies in the garage and remove the infant from the car seat after the paparazzi swarmed the car, and a loud noise which sounded like a gunshot had gone off. Instead of being permitted to rescue the infant and being thanked for putting herself in peril to rescue the infant, she was told to “get out of the shot”. Also later in the nursery, when one infant regurgitated some milk, another nurse was temporarily blocked from assisting the infant who needed suctioning in order to make sure that a taping of Nadya feedings would not be interrupted.

All of this was made worse for the babies by the conduct of Jeff Czech, Nadya’s attorney, who entered the house like a raging bull, screaming, pointing and waving his finger about one inch from the face of one of AIW’s nannies and myself. He was shouting and yelling obscenities to our AIW nanny, stating “get the f out of here, all of you are fired”, and then hit his hand hard against the outer wall of the nursery. This violent atmosphere and loud noise we believe, had a negative impact on the babies who had just come from a quiet hospital nursery.

Also Nadya’s other children were permitted to touch the new babies without sanitizing their hands and many of the numerous people allowed into the nursery also had not sanitized themselves.

All AIW personnel were extremely concerned by the violence and threats of violence . One of the AIW representatives was crying. I told Jeff not to touch me. Linda told him she would “deck him” if he did.

Nadya, as the mother of these babies and other children is responsible for the dangerous environment in her home which she permitted and even encouraged by allowing the media inside, with no security provided and little or no boundaries set.

The babies appeared to be treated as props after their feeding. Nadya handed them off to the nurse to be cared for while she slept all night.

After March 17, the nurses had many concerns about the babies, Nadya’s extremely minimal involvement or even apparent interest in the babies unless cameras were rolling were among their concerns. For example, AIW spent a total of 102 hours in the Suleman home. Out of this time Nadya spent only 8 hours in the nursery. Much of the time she was out of the house shopping and when she did return she often did not stop at the nursery to see the babies or inquire about how they were doing. She was encouraged by AIW to feed, hold, change and bathe the babies herself, but rarely did it. One baby went for days without being bathed. Finally the nurse did it when Nadya continued to give excuses as to why she could not.

There were many other concerns as well. Security was not provided and Linda will address the specifics of that issue including the fact that 2 intruders entered the property after March 17, 2009 and even though Linda and I asked for security measures (see my e-mail to Jeff) appropriate security was not provided for the babies, nannies and nurses. Another issue is that AIW had a major concern about the nannies that Nadya had obtained to care for the babies.

Finally, although on behalf of AIW, I asked Jeff to arrange for a meeting in person or by telephone with AIW, Nadya, Jeff, myself, and Dr. Phil to address our continuing concerns about the health, safety and welfare of the babies, he would never agree to such a meeting and instead kept insisting that AIW agree to a non-disclosure clause and non-transparency and he insisted that I was not permitted to speak to Nadya about our concerns or anything else.

On Sunday morning, I sent an e-mail to Dr. Phil stating that under the circumstances we could not continue. On Sunday afternoon Jeff sent an e-mail terminating AIW.

Nadya admits that she knew about AIW’s complaint to child protective services which they are required by law to make if they believe babies or children are endangered. We believe that may have been the reason that she and her attorney made the decision that they did to terminate AIW.

We are now concerned about the future of the children. Nadya has decided to have Kaiser Permanente care for her babies. In other words, she has apparently made a conscious decision to put the burden of her babies care on the tax payers, since her lawyer Jeff has conceded publicly that Kaiser nurses will most likely have to bill Medi-Cal. Further Kaiser nurses and doctors will be silenced and not be permitted to speak publicly about the specifics of the care that Nadya gives or fails to give to her babies.

This is advantageous to Nadya and her lawyer since the public will only be told their side and will not be able to get all of the facts as they could if Nadya had kept her agreement with AIW and Dr. Phil to allow supportive care by AIW, and complete transparency by permitting Linda to speak.

We ask what are they trying to hide and why?

Our concern is and always has been the protection and the care of these babies. If the past week is a predictor of the future, we are not optimistic. AIW, the strong advocates, the voice of these babies has been silenced, in the only way that Nadya and Jeff could.

We wish the best for Nadya and these babies and their six siblings, but we can now only pray to God, that Nadya’s poor choices, money making schemes, and improper priorities will not result in irreparable harm to any or all of her children in the future.

Gloria Allred
Attorney at Law
representing AIW
March 25, 2009

Octuplets: Morning after first two octuplets home (video)

March 30, 2009

(3-30) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

I’m not sure what happened but some of radaronline’s videos have become embeddable. This is a video from the morning after she brought the first two home from the hospital. Most interesting is the exchange between the interviewer and Nadya about security. Nadya was talking about a neighbor lady being in the bushes with her kids.

MAN: Are you going to put in an alarm system - a security system?

NADYA: That’s a good - yes, definitely. I forgot about that. My head is racing.

Yeah, in the middle of the night, some guy came over. Yeah, I know. Some strange guy came over. Young. Young. They’re always young.

They’re always? So this has happened several times before and she still had not gotten a security system. So did Munoz actually discuss it? And if he had people willing to provide security that first night for free - why didn’t he do something about it?

Watch how she reacts to a stranger at her house in the middle of the night with no security when her babies have just come home.

NADYA: And I don’t get angry. I mean, I don’t know what he wanted.

MAN: That’s gonna be…

NADYA: Kinda feaky, yeah. It scared me. And the nanny’s like, ‘Who’s this? Who do you want?’ [Laughs]….

MAN:…What time was this?

NADYA: Like two - three o’clock in the morning.

Watch how close the camera gets to the infant in the crib. Later she talks about how no one is to be in there. Then the man asks about the “father”.

MAN: Did you get any calls from the father?

NADYA: The who? The who?

MAN: Is there a father…at all?

NADYA: No.

What’s funny about the fact that 10 boys will have no male role model? Something that was premeditated.Just what how she reacts to the interviewer. She giggles like a teenage girl.

She has frequently said in defense of not needing AIW is that her children are not at risk - not medically fragile. Here she admits it.

NADYA: They’re big. They don’t even remind me of preemies. They’re still at risk because they were born so early.

MAN: Did you get up last night? Were you worried at all about that?

NADYA: I walked in and I got worried about contamination. I worried about people in here and we’re not supposed-nobody supposed to be in here. So I did worry, especially that many people. That’s just not ok. I got reprimanded alot by the hospital.

MAN: You did?

NADYA: They said that if we’re considering that allowing that to happen again, they won’t release the babies.

So she just admitted that no one is supposed to be there - no neighborhood people can be there - nobody can be around the octuplets except her kids - and yet standing right there is the interviewer and camera person (if they’re not the same). Watch how close the camera lens gets to the babies.

NADYA: They can’t - it’s RSV season and so nobody would be able to actually come face to face with them except my kids - they’re an exception. Yeah, it’s just not safe - it’s not safe for them - even adults. [laughs]

MAN: All it takes is one crazy…

NADYA: That’s all it takes is one crazy. And sometimes it’s hard to discern who is very emotionally stable and who is not, especially if I just barely see them. I have to be very cautious and protective of me and my family, because it’s hard to discern who is mentally stable and who’s not. So I can’t automatically prejudge them. You don’t know…If they ask for an autograph, I ask for theirs cuz what’s the difference between me and them? Nothing.

So at the beginning she laughs talking about a stranger coming to the door at 3 am and then she says in response to his question that she forgot about a security system and then at the end says she has to be very protective of her family. No connection at all. She says things like they are required lines. Just like the line about hiw no one is to be face to face with the children or in the nursery and here he and the cameraman are. No clue. She also admits that the hospital reprimanded her as well as AIW. So a report got back to the hospital independent of AIW.

She really has no idea what she reveals in these interviews. She just confirmed what AIW and Allred said in their statement.

Octuplets: Publicist #2 to quit, Victor Munoz, speaks

March 30, 2009

(3-30) Octuplets: Updated list of posts

[CAPS and EMPHASIS throughout added]

The scum continues to rise to the top. Victor Munoz who quit because Nadya “is nuts!” has has come forward to defend Nadya. Who can possibly believe any of these people? The first publicist, Joann Killeen, who also quit (death threats), believed Nadya when she said she was working and supporting the children herself without welfare. Killeen came forward on the 26th and explained that her duties included playing with and bathing the older children. About Nadya and her parents:

KILLEEN: They have a unique way of using people. Manipulating people, getting what they want and moving on.

And now Munoz, who said it was a matter of conscience that he couldn’t work for Nadya - no mention of Allred or AIW - is sticking up for Nadya. How much is he getting paid by Radaronline?

Here is what he said to Usmagazine when he quit. Note that not a word of it mentions AIW or Gloria Allred - just greedy, nutty Nadya.

It just got to be too much. It’s pretty much a free for all over there right now. They are freaking out right now. Not to sound arrogant, but those people depended on me for everything. You have no idea what I’ve had to do for these people.

NADYA GOT REAL GREEDY.

THIS WOMAN IS NUTS.

This I can say: what ultimately destroyed the business arrangement was personal reasons.

People:

In good conscience, I can’t continue representing Nadya.

But his conscience is just fine defending her for a little cash on the side. Everyone associated with her is nuts. The real reason for his coming forward is revealed near the end of the interview. He mentioned that Nadya’s lawyer, Jeff Czech, said on the Dr Phil show that no one could have guessed what would happen when the first octuplets came home. He said: I did! And then went on to defend himself about getting security in place. This interview took place after he saw the Dr Phil show - later that same day. He is just defending himself - he actually says things have gone downhill since he left - implying they were fine when he was there - so if they were - why the complaints now?

Bottom line: no matter what he says in this video or tomorrow or on the witness stand - he “in good conscience” walked away and he said she was NUTS & GREEDY. Period.

Here is Mr Munoz talking with Dr Phil on Larry King - he admits to being intimidated by Gloria Allred and Dr Phil.

The entire transcript is in another post - follow the link above. CNN video doesn’t embed here.

DR PHIL: …are you concerned about her level of problem solving, her level of problem recognition?

MUNOZ: You know what, I don’t. At first, before I met her and I was watching her on television and, also, I was thinking the same thing. But getting to know her and really understanding her — I mean I think I spend more time with her than just about anybody does right now. And the more I get to know her, the more I know she is level-headed. You know, there’s — I mean there’s nothing wrong with her. She’s a sweet lady.

So, first impression she’s not together…then she’s level-headed, sweet and there’s nothing wrong with her…then she’s nuts and greedy and his conscience won’t allow him to work with her…and now she’s sweet and needs defending. This man wouldn’t even make it into the witness box. Gloria Allred would probably love to cross examine him. Just listen and read his own words. His own words and tone of voice say exactly what his agenda is.

Here Dr Phil discusses transparency:

MCGRAW: Is she prepared to accept the reality that if these children come home to her, that there has to be total transparency, where the proper authorities, agencies, nurses, whatever, can see what’s going on with those children?

MUNOZ: Absolutely. She knows that her life is going to be an open book.

Seems she forgot very quickly. And in this radaronline interview he says what she does in not anyone’s business as long as she’s not spending the government’s money - which she still is and has been doing since before she started producing babies. Her hospital bill combined with the octuplets has got to be well over a milllion dollars. Kaiser nurses she is using now she is not paying for - California taxpayers are.

As far how as he got his job.

MCGRAW: OK. All right. Now, let me ask you — and then I want to get back to what is going to be required for these children. You’ve taken over as the publicist in this situation. You were asked to do so. You didn’t ask for this, it asked for you.

MUNOZ: I never asked for this.

But he accepted the job and then walked away and is now defending himself by pretending to defend Nadya.

Dr Phil talking with Allred via satellite during the same show.

MCGRAW: And he [Munoz] says that he can’t understand why you’re involved and that he feels threatened, on behalf of his client, that they’re going to be pushed or bullied into something.

Then the interview with Munoz continues.

DR PHIL: What’s wrong with the offer?

MUNOZ: The offer itself, I don’t know. I don’t know what the whole offer is. I have tried to call Linda directly and I haven’t received a phone call back. There’s just not enough hours in the day for me to drive out and see Gloria Allred in Los Angeles and make the meeting on her time

So something that he now says he felt uncomfortable about he didn’t have time to bother with. So what do his words mean? And which ones?

MCGRAW: Do you feel threatened and bullied by her with ultimatums and deadlines and that sort of thing?

MUNOZ: A little. When you hear Gloria Allred, obviously, you feel that way. And me being someone that’s never done this before, I do. And that’s pretty much it.

So he admits to his castration anxiety, which is what it usually comes down to. But that’s not all - he’s scared of Dr Phil.

MCGRAW: Remember the first night this came up, I told you that I knew Gloria. And I said she was a good egg.

MUNOZ: You did. I understand.

MCGRAW: And you’re probably questioning that.

MUNOZ: I did. I’m a little scared of you too.

In this radaronline he talks about the “anonymous help” he alleges he had lined up but never implemented. He also talked about it with Dr Phil. So why didn’t he as Nadya’s agent push for it then - especially if he felt uncomfortable with AIW? That’s his job - to look out for Nadya and he wasn’t. And then he quit.

MUNOZ: You’re right. If I can get 30 seconds, basically what’s been going on in the last two weeks is I have been working hard with Kaiser. They have been really putting together a great plan to have these children come home. I’ve been getting a lot of calls, a lot of people anonymously that have been wanting to help. We have a lot of help out there.

But what did he do about it? Nothing. He said to radaronline that “he knew from day one that it would not work.”

And his solution?

He quit.

He says AIW “didn’t understand the way Nadya thought.”

How does she think? Does she? A responsible mother would not have walked back into that IVF facility to get implanted with 6 more embyros - something she finally admitted to. Her father said to Oprah that she’s “not mentally complete” and could Oprah get her a mental evaluation and her mother said Nadya was incapable of caring for those children.

Munoz talks about the Kaiser list:

The misunderstanding is that nobody ever said to Dr Phil that the kids were not gonna come home if the list was [sic] completely finished….the list did not say the kids aren’t not coming home if you don’t do these specific things - they were merely suggestions.

Not what he said to Dr Phil. See below.

That’s how it was spun…I’m the one…I’m the one...this list that was really nothing.

Here’s what Munoz said about the list to Dr Phil in their Larry King interview. Munoz made it clear that they had to do the things on the list and that they were more than “suggestions”. Dr Phil clearly says Nadya and Munoz called him and Munoz does not correct him. Opposite of what he says in this radaronline video.

MCGRAW: Good. On Wednesday, you and Nadya called me at the studio right before we taped the last part of the interview show that we put up. And she was very concerned at that point because of a meeting that you guys had had with the Kaiser Permanente people, saying that there had to be certain standards met, of course, which makes common sense. What did they say specifically and who were you talking to and where is that now?

MUNOZ: Well, we were talking with Kaiser. We had a big meeting with, you know, basically, the whole entire staff that was helping her out. And it was one of the first meetings we had talking about releasing the babies. And it hit her. It hit her hard. She realized that she does have eight babies coming home. And she’s excited, she’s scared. And she wants to get the house ready in time for these kids to come home.

MCGRAW: Was there a conclusion that the house was not ready at that point, based on what they had seen with the RadarOnline.com footage and that sort of thing?

MUNOZ: There was some. The — you know, they wanted a couple of things done, obviously, because there are preemies coming home. They wanted carpets changed, fresh paint on the walls, cracks taken care of — you know, normal maintenance on the house.

Just suggestions? Cracks in the wall?

MCGRAW: What is the progress right now on meeting the standards and requirements that you understand to be important in terms of housing and manpower and all of the things that are required to support these children?

MUNOZ: Well, you know, I mean they did ask us to do a lot, you know, as far as refreshing up the house and getting everything ready. And we’re getting close. You know, we’re almost there. You know, we’re in the middle of finding their new home. We narrowed it down to a few and we’re getting ready to pick one. That should be picked out, you know, this weekend. And once we get into that, there’s a big — there’s a big chunk of that list is taken off, you know and…

…MCGRAW: Is Nadya doing anything to prepare herself as a mother, in terms of any parenting, there’s logistics training, any type of therapeutic support from her through Kaiser Permanente or others to get herself ready for this challenge?

MUNOZ: You know what, at this point not. No, there’s nothing. I mean she’s already been taking care of six children. And she’s ready to jump into the new eight.

Then Dr Phil asked if the hospital would let more than one could go home. Remember, the list is nothing - merely suggestions.

MUNOZ: They told us we would — they would not. There’s a couple of things that need to be done. There’s — we need to redo these bedrooms. We need to make sure that there’s enough room for them, you know. And we need to give them their own space. One child, yes. Eight, no.

Does a “normal” list for preemies going home include redoing bedrooms? Dr Phil kept hammering away at this point. Munoz should have read the transcript before he did this video. Here he admits that they couldn’t go home because the “list” wasn’t finished. A tad more than a suggestion.

MCGRAW: So they’ve made it clear, if multiples were ready to be released today, they could not do it?

MUNOZ: CORRECT.

MCGRAW: What would they do? Would they keep them at the hospital? What would they do?

MUNOZ: They would hold onto them as long as they could, you know. But they know that we’re working hard. So they really haven’t given us too many ultimatums.

And here it is:

MUNOZ: THEY DID SAY, ‘LOOK, YOU NEED TO GET THROUGH THIS LIST’.

It wasn’t exactly nothing. It wasn’t merely a suggestion. It lead to Nadya getting another house, which also needed to be cleared by Kaiser people and generated another list. Things that were fixed by people Dr Phil got to donate after Nadya agreed to use AIW. Nadya says in her own words that the house her 6 children were living in was not fit for children. She was speaking to Lara Spencer from “The Insider”.

SPENCER: On a serious note, how are the conditions at the house? Is it a clean, safe place?

NADYA: I don’t believe it’s safe enough for the kids at this moment.

Ok. There are his own words and Nadya’s. She admits that her house is not safe for the octuplets - it wasn’t safe for the older ones either. Then he continues, implying that the problems now are because he left and because they didn’t follow his instructions.

Since I’ve left I’ve seen nothing but a downward spiral, and I feel really bad for that because I left.

Because I left with a lot of information for them to follow up on and apparently they didn’t.

Security - I had many security companies offering their services for free to be there that first night. I mean, Jeffrey Czech said today on Dr Phil that nobody could have foreseen what was gonna happen when those kids came home.

That’s wrong.

I saw it.

And what did he do?

He quit.

His words are useless and meant as a defense for his actions. Just read his words and compare them - nothing else is needed. He’s reacting to what Nadya’s new spokesman (her lawyer) is saying about what wasn’t done before he got there - aka what Munoz didn’t do. And who can possibly prove what information he left with them? If he wasn’t defending her, she would probably come out and say no he didn’t. Who knows, maybe she will anyway.

Now listen to the anger in his voice:

The only way she is going to make money from this point on would be endorsement book deals, future shows…and there’s nothing wrong with that.

So is he setting the stage for a reality show? Defending what he tried to set up?

As long as she doesn’t spend the government’s money, I don’t understand why other people were complaining.

And who is paying for the octuplet’s care? The hospital bill? Her hospital bill? Is she still getting food stamps?

And how can he not understand why people were upset about her having so many children? He, an adult, quit because he couldn’t deal with her. And 14 children?

He was asked what does Nadya need to do to make sure the kids are safe and growing up in a good environment? And the first words he said were the truth, even though he laughed. 14 children’s lives are not funny.

Clean house and start over. [laugh] She needs to continue what she’s doing - and that’s to be the best mother she possible can.

Here you wonder if he wants back in.

I really think she needs to bring in some real professionals to help with her both her personal life and her career. Because without one she doesn’t have another. She’s not gonna have a personal life if she doesn’t have a career. And she’s not gonna be able to build a career if she can’t have a personal life with her children.

That last sentence says it all - she can’t have a career if she doesn’t have the octuplets. And what is with this word “career”. What is Bobbi McCaughey’s career? Tells you exactly what he thinks being a mother is and who he puts first.

And notice there weren’t any questions addressing his comments about her being greedy and nuts and what was it that made him unable to work with her.

Why?

Octuplets: Gloria Allred rebuts Nadya - Showbiz Tonight

March 28, 2009

(3-28) Updated list of octuplet posts

Gloria Allred's appearance on SHOWBIZ TONIGHT March 26th to rebut Nadya's radaronline video. AJ Hammer is the host. Transcript provided by CNN. Specific points:

• Angels in Waiting unprofessional and unethical
• How much time Nadya spent with the babies - only 8 out of 108 hrs.
  
• Nannies with a cough and positive skin test (ppd) for tuberculosis
  
• Security vs jacuzzi
  

HAMMER: In a brand-new video just out today, octomom Nadya Suleman is firing back at the nursing group she kicked out of her house for making some shocking allegations against her. And we have the nurses` attorney, Gloria Allred, all ready to answer the octomom point by outrageous point. And among the shocking allegations, nurses from Angels in Waiting are claiming octomom neglected her babies. According to them, mommy just wasn`t around that much. They also claim that octomom may have exposed her kids to tuberculosis and one of the nannies octomom hired even had a terrible cough.

Now the octomom showdown, claim by claim, with the attorney for Angels in Waiting, Gloria Allred, who is with us tonight from Hollywood. Always good to see you, Gloria. Let`s get right to it and let`s begin with octomom Nadya Suleman`s explosive charge. We`re calling this claim number one, that the nurses from Angels in Waiting were unprofessional. In her new diary which is posted RadarOnline.com today, Suleman even mentions your name, Gloria. Let`s watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SULEMAN: To Gloria, that I personally believe if she really knew the - or really experienced what I experienced and she knew how unprofessional and unethical those nurses were and are, she would never have chosen to support them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAMMER: All right. Gloria, she says that you wouldn`t have done this at all. What do you have to say to that?

GLORIA ALLRED, ATTORNEY: Well, I think I know the Angels in Waiting nurses and nanny and educational consultant a lot better than Nadya does. And I have observed them. I have been very involved with their work while they were in her home. I`ve spoken to them many times on a daily basis and to help them get support and resolve some of the issues that were there because her attorney, Nadya`s attorney, would not allow me to speak directly to Nadya. And her attorney also would not allow for a meeting, which I asked for about five or six days running either in person or on the phone with Nadya and the nurses to work these things out.

They are of the highest quality, the Angels in Waiting nurses. They are extremely professional. And I`m sorry that Nadya has taken this tactic of trying to attack them. She, of course, doesn't give her basis for saying that.

Also in this "Radar Online" interview today done by her, A.J., the reporter or whoever was posing the questions to her, misstated much of what we said at the news conference we held yesterday and that we put out in a written press release. So she was actually being fed, you know, a number of questions that - involving statements we never said.

HAMMER: Some factual inaccuracies there.

ALLRED: Yes.

HAMMER: I`ll let you address a couple of them if they`re a part of our list here. Among the claims in the new video diary posted on "Radar Online," Nadya shoots down claim number two made by the nurses that she didn`t spend time with her babies as much as she should have. Let`s watch that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SULEMAN: Honestly, that`s a joke. All of that is beyond catastrophied(ph). I was in there as much as I could until I felt completely rejected by them and almost I felt so like a stranger in my own home. And they were constantly interrogating me and waiting, just waiting. The angels waiting for me to make a mistake, right. Well, they were in there maybe less than half of what they claimed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAMMER: All right. She refutes it, Gloria. Have at it.

ALLRED: Well, you know, they were keeping the documentation. I don`t think Nadya was. Because they are registered nurses. They have charts. They have written down who fed the babies and when mom came in, you know, what she did, how often she was there, you know, taking care of the babies.

This is what they do as registered nurses. And they kept careful track of the time she was in the nursery. And, unfortunately, the eight hours of the more than 100 hours they were there from March 17th to March 22nd. You know, she was rarely there except to feed the babies when the cameras were rolling, and just, you know, a little bit when the cameras were not rolling.

They urged her to come in, bathe the babies, change the babies, hold the babies, love the babies, feed the babies and she didn`t. She was just basically missing action. A lot of times, she was out of the home. We know she was shopping for clothing or other things. And she needed to be with her babies when they came home from the hospital because otherwise she has no meaningful involvement with them, A.J.

She`s not going to be able to bond with her babies and her babies with her. She`s the mom. The nurses are not babysitters. They`re there to support her, guide her, help her in any way, teach her how to parent her babies, her premature babies. And unfortunately, they couldn`t do that if she was literally not in the house.

HAMMER: All right. Let`s move on to claim number three. The octomom`s response to the incredible claim by the nurses that some of the nannies that the octomom hired tested positive for tuberculosis. Let`s watch the octomom on that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SULEMAN: There was two individuals who, because they`ve had vaccinations as children, it shows positive. My mom said the same thing. So their chest x-ray is clear and that`s all that matters. There was a nanny with a cough. It didn`t mean she had TB. I wasn`t comfortable with anyone even having a cold, so she was asked to leave.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAMMER: All right, Gloria. Back to you on this. Octomom claiming there was no danger. Is that how you see it?

ALLRED: No, of course. We see it as a real risk and, you know, we didn`t say that she hired them or didn`t hire them. Again, that wouldn`t be accurate. What we said is these nannies, a lot of them, a number of them - 15 of them appeared for training in the home - in her home, training by Kaiser Permanente and our nurses and our representatives were present. So they were able to observe what happened. And, yes. One nanny who appeared had a very deep cough. They were also told that there were positive test results for some other nannies for TB and that they really need to have a chest x-ray to confirm whether they had TB. We don`t know if they did or not.

But the point is this, that any nannies who might have tested positive, whether or not subsequently their chest x-rays were clear, they shouldn`t have been in the home, anywhere near those babies, anywhere near those six other children, anywhere near the nurses, the nannies, you know, parents, grandparents - anybody else in that home, because tuberculosis, A.J. is airborne and that is not a risk anybody should be taking.

HAMMER: No. Absolutely not. I have one more claim I want to get to quickly, Gloria. Octomom also answered a claim that she had enough money for a Jacuzzi but not enough to pay for security for her home. Let`s watch that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SULEMAN: I didn`t buy a Jacuzzi. It was donated by friends. And in regards to a security team, I actually have a friend who is working on security who is also donating.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So are you working on security?

SULEMAN: Oh, yes. That takes precedence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAMMER: Gloria, I only have 10 seconds for your answer, but are you satisfied by that explanation?

ALLRED: Working on security? There have been reports of three intruders there. One of our nannies actually was asked by Nadya to call 911 because Nadya didn`t want to have yet another call from her to 911 about a potential intruder in the backyard. She needed to get security immediately and that is an investment in her children and her children`s safety, her babies` safety. And that`s not something that should be put off.

HAMMER: All right. I`ll leave it at that. Gloria, we always appreciate you being with us. Thanks so much.

ALLRED: Thank you.